Hello Nad,

Yes, I think you are completely right. However, that time it was anything
amazing for me. The holography was not interactive but I think that it had
not any kind of screen. Of course I know that you know much more about this
than myself, I am nule. I only wanted to tell my experience. Do not worry!

Thanks for your reply,

Regina

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nad" <nad@daytar.de>
To: <list@rhizome.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 3:20 PM
Subject: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 3D Holographic projectors?

>i post this for the second time, as the previous post seems to have
>disappeared:
>
> Hello Regina
>
> i think what you saw, was probably something
> i would call a traditional hologramm. especially if this
> was an exhibition in the eighties. i couldnt find
> out what was shown in the exhibition you wrote about, but hologramms
> were sort of hip in the eighties. people are still quite
> active in this field, but they are nowadays rather banned
> to science museums and other nonarts places (with some exeptions :-)).
> however since the eighties are hip again (?), we will may be get soon a
> hologramm art revival...:-)
>
> and yes regina i think you are right -it would look quite good for
> dirks purpose.
> however these hologramms 1) need a screen/display and 2) are
> sofar not interactive...or lets say only in low quality
> (please see my links in the thread)
>
> BUT DIRK DOESNT WANT TO USE A DISPLAY......!
>
> if dirk would use a display, he could e.g. take an animated
> hologramm, which is not interactive. may be he could
> switch it on and off....for the interactive part :-( :-)
>
> displays in the size of 1x2m are available for 15000 Euros
> e.g. from this british company:
> http://www.3d-print.com/holodisplays.html
>
> nad
>
>
> P.S. you can produce your own hologramm by using a laser pointer
> and a programm to generate a digital hologramm
> at this site by Doctor Stein:
> http://www.medcosm.com/prog_CGHmaker.htm
>
>
>
> Regina Celia Pinto wrote:
>
>> Hello Dirk,
>> >
>> > Someone else mailed me privately she saw something like this being
>> done in
>> > the eighties, so i guess that might have been a laser projection. Do
>> you
>> > or
>> > anyone else know what quality of image such techniques might be
>> capable of
>> > in outdoor conditions? Or whether you could have the static 3d input
>> mixed
>> > with other input like words or part of words going through it,
>> whether you
>> > could fade in/out inputs and overlap them in time?
>> >
>>
>> Yes, I saw the castle of the "Facteur Cheval"
>> (http://www.aricie.fr/facteur-cheval/) as holography in the XVI S�o
>> Paulo
>> Bienalle, 1981. The exhibition of this castle was part of the
>> "Outsider Art
>> Exhibition", one of the manifestations of the XVI bienalle, curated
>> by
>> Victor Musgrave. I have the catalogue of this part of the bienalle
>> with me,
>> but unfortunatelly it does not show a photo of the holography and also
>> it
>> does not have any text about it. However I remember that there were
>> projectors that seemed to be lasers to make the 3d light image, which
>> was
>> not so big but completely astonishing for me. Perhaps someone else in
>> this
>> list visited the XVI S�o Paulo bienalle and should give you better
>> information than me.
>>
>> I imagine that your catedral could use the same process because also
>> it is
>> an architecture.
>>
>> I hope you get it!
>>
>> Regina C�lia Pinto
>>
>> http://arteonline.arq.br/
>> http://arteonline.arq.br/library.htm
>>
>> New Works:
>>
>> http://arteonline.arq.br/magic_walls/
>> http://arteonline.arq.br/eva/
>> http://arteonline.arq.br/ducks/
>>
>>
> +
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>
>

A mistake below, please the ward was GUNS and not games.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Regina Pinto" <reginapinto@arteonline.arq.br>
To: "Andrei Thomaz" <andreithomaz@gmail.com>
Cc: <list@rhizome.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 4:03 PM
Subject: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: Another 3d Engine

> Hello Andrei,
>
> I liked your answers very much. Thanks! However, I think that if I would
> by a game to give to children, I would never buy a violent game. Also I
> never buy toys like revolvers and GUNS to them.
>
> Please keep on sending me information on your research.
>
> Bye,
>
> Regina
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andrei Thomaz" <andreithomaz@gmail.com>
> To: "Regina Pinto" <reginapinto@arteonline.arq.br>
> Cc: <list@rhizome.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 12:44 PM
> Subject: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: Another 3d Engine
>
>
>> hello Regina,
>>
>> 1) yes, I think it can. Violence is not a key element in SimCity, for
>> example.
>> 2) well, maybe the two things can happen. As I can think that I am
>> shooting my boss when I kill a monster in a game, I also can think I
>> am shooting a monster when I kill my teacher or my boss. So, it is not
>> so simple. We can't not blame games for making people think they can
>> solve their problems eliminating the others, because there is a lot of
>> religions and governments that think the same, since centuries ago.
>>
>> bye,
>> andrei
>>
>>
>> On 1/4/06, Regina Pinto <reginapinto@arteonline.arq.br> wrote:
>>> Thanks for clarifying me Andrei. I am waiting for your answer to Dirk
>>> Vekemans questions, but also I would like to know if you are only
>>> researching the technology of games or if you are also researching the
>>> Philosophy of them. If so, there are some questions that I would like to
>>> ask
>>> you:
>>>
>>> 1- Do you think that a game without violence can be interesting?
>>>
>>> 2- Do not you think that the violence of games can make people think
>>> that
>>> real violence and wars are only games? Or do you think that the violence
>>> of
>>> games serves exactly for people liberate their own violence in an
>>> environment of game?
>>>
>>> Aquele abraco,
>>>
>>> Regina
>>>
>>
>> +
>> -> post: list@rhizome.org
>> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
>> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
>> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
>> +
>> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
>> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>>
>>
>

Hello Curt and Michael,

I visit your links and liked them. Your daughter is very cute Curt! And it
seems to me that she will be an artist.
I would like to invite you and all to visit
http://arteonline.arq.br/pixar.htm . There you will find my beloved Bruno,
two years old, playing with his favorite toy: Woody, from Toy Story. Since
Christmas whem he discovered the Toy Story video, he has watched the movie
or has played with his Woody. In spite of being almost a baby, he is able
to watch the whole video and he already knows the name of several characters
of the film. It seems to me that it is anything interesting to say here,
where you have been talking about Pixar and MOMA Exhibition. Do not you
think that this kind of exhibition is necessary to attract public to
museums and to form a habit of visiting museums in children. Being there
children can visit other exhibitions and start to understand Art and
museums. Well it is only a thought that I have observing Bruno and reading
your talk.

By the way, do not strange the size of Bruno's T-shirt. That t-shirt is
mine. It is a t-shirt of a carnival parade. ;-)

Bye,

Regina

----- Original Message -----
From: "Curt Cloninger" <curt@lab404.com>
To: "Michael Szpakowski" <szpako@yahoo.com>; <list@rhizome.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 2:03 PM
Subject: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: Re: UNIVERSAL ACID COUNTDOWN!!!!!!!

> At 2:27 AM -0800 1/4/06, Michael Szpakowski wrote:
>>All great but
>>http://playdamage.org/64.html
>>particularly so - a collaboration, I take it?
>
> Hi Michael,
>
> Yes, a collaboration with my eldest daughter, Caroline. That last
> instruction is a pun. "The light turned on" is the light of the lightning
> bugs.
>
> Caroline, as you may recall, is the recipient of last year's prestigious
> Genius 2000 Golden Palm for Lifetime Achievement:
> http://www.geocities.com/genius-2000/Winners2005.html
> http://lab404.com/watercolor/caroline.jpg
>
> She made her net art debut here in 2000:
> http://playdamage.org/6.html
>
> best,
> curt
>
> p.s. view source at each playdamage screen for source credits.
> +
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>
>

Hello Andrei,

I liked your answers very much. Thanks! However, I think that if I would by
a game to give to children, I would never buy a violent game. Also I never
buy toys like revolvers and games to them.

Please keep on sending me information on your research.

Bye,

Regina

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrei Thomaz" <andreithomaz@gmail.com>
To: "Regina Pinto" <reginapinto@arteonline.arq.br>
Cc: <list@rhizome.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 12:44 PM
Subject: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: Another 3d Engine

> hello Regina,
>
> 1) yes, I think it can. Violence is not a key element in SimCity, for
> example.
> 2) well, maybe the two things can happen. As I can think that I am
> shooting my boss when I kill a monster in a game, I also can think I
> am shooting a monster when I kill my teacher or my boss. So, it is not
> so simple. We can't not blame games for making people think they can
> solve their problems eliminating the others, because there is a lot of
> religions and governments that think the same, since centuries ago.
>
> bye,
> andrei
>
>
> On 1/4/06, Regina Pinto <reginapinto@arteonline.arq.br> wrote:
>> Thanks for clarifying me Andrei. I am waiting for your answer to Dirk
>> Vekemans questions, but also I would like to know if you are only
>> researching the technology of games or if you are also researching the
>> Philosophy of them. If so, there are some questions that I would like to
>> ask
>> you:
>>
>> 1- Do you think that a game without violence can be interesting?
>>
>> 2- Do not you think that the violence of games can make people think that
>> real violence and wars are only games? Or do you think that the violence
>> of
>> games serves exactly for people liberate their own violence in an
>> environment of game?
>>
>> Aquele abraco,
>>
>> Regina
>>
>
> +
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/preferences/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php
>
>

Parabens Andrei, uma excelente pesquisa!
Voce pretende desenvolver um "game"?

Congratulations Andrei, an excellent research!
Do you intend to develop a game?

Regina Celia Pinto

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrei R. Thomaz" <andreithomaz@gmail.com>
To: <list@rhizome.org>
Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 1:23 AM
Subject: RHIZOME\_RAW: Another 3d Engine

> [portuguese version below]
>
>
> dear friends,
>
> I would like to send the url of my newest work:
>
> Another 3d Engine
> http://www.rgbdesigndigital.com.br/atravesdoespelho/another3d/index\_en.htm
>
> happy 2006,
> andrei
>
>
> ABOUT ANOTHER 3D ENGINE
> 3D engines can be found in any software (game or application) using 3D
> graphics. They are responsable for the rendering (exhibition at the
> screen) of these graphics, doing the drawing of polygons, the calculation
> of perspective and shading, and the texturing of objects. They also do the
> transformations (rotation, offset, scale) of objects, and many of they
> also do animations.
>
> As main criteria, and goal, of 3d engine creators, we have the search of
> the highest possible level of realism at the images generated by the 3d
> engines. Even when we have scenes that are not, apparently, realists, what
> changes is the referencial of this realism. For example, several games
> have scenes where we have low gravity (where the referencial is, usually,
> the Moon surface) or zero gravity (sideral space), but, in these cases,
> it's easy to identify the referencial.
>
> In searching this realism, the 3d engines use different kinds of
> algorithms. It is necessary to guarantee that closer polygons be drawed
> over polygons more distant (they do a calculation to set the order of
> drawing); the light and shading have to consider all the light sources
> available at each scene, as well the materials characteristics; if we have
> transparences, the 3d engine also needs to draw correctly the objects that
> will be visible through the transparent material. These, and others, are
> the things that programmers have to worry about.
>
> Another 3d engine shows a set of modifications in the logic of a 3d
> engine. For that, we used a relatively simple 3d engine, developped in
> Java, Browser3D, distributed as open source software. We used the library
> Java2D to make these changes, that happen in the drawing of objects.
>
> For the first work of Another 3d Engine, we looked for a scene that was
> the 3d equivalent of Hello World. Printing the message Hello World at the
> computer screen is the task of the first program that a beginner learns
> when studying any programming language; almost every book and tutorial
> about programming start with an exampled called Hello World. We choosed as
> the equivalent of Hello World the rendering of a cube. Not a normal cube,
> but a color cube, as the created at the first chapter of Getting Started
> with Java 3D, written by Sun's team (Java3D is one of the most powerful
> libraries for the rendering of tridimensional graphics available today).
>
> Each one of images below links for a different version of Another 3d
> Engine; in eachone, the modifications I have done are different, in such a
> way you will see different ways of drawing a color cube, rotating around
> itself, at the computer screen.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> caros amigos,
>
> dando inicio ao ano de 2006, gostaria de enviar para voces o endereco do
> meu trabalho mais recente:
>
> Another 3d Engine
> http://www.rgbdesigndigital.com.br/atravesdoespelho/another3d/
>
> []'s
> andrei
>
>
> SOBRE ANOTHER 3D ENGINE
>
> 3d engines sao encontrados em qualquer software (jogo ou aplicativo) que
> utilize graficos tridimensionais. Eles sao responsaveis pela renderizacao
> (exibicao) destes graficos, realizando o desenho de poligonos, o calculo
> da perspectiva e do sombreamento, e o preenchimento com texturas. Tambem
> calculam as transformacoes (rotacao, deslocamento, escalonamento) dos
> objetos, e muitos tambem disponibilizam funcoes de animacao.
>
> Como criterio principal de avaliacao e como objetivo principal dos
> criadores de 3d engines, temos a busca do maior grau de realismo possivel
> nas imagens geradas. Mesmo quando temos cenarios que nao sao,
> aparentemente, realistas, o que muda e o referencial deste realismo. Por
> exemplo, diversos jogos apresentam cenarios de baixa gravidade (onde o
> referencial e, geralmente, a superficie da Lua) ou de gravidade zero
> (espaco sideral), mas, nestes casos, raramente temos dificuldade em
> identificar o referencial utilizado.
>
> Em busca desse realismo, os 3d engines se valem de diferentes metodos de
> programacao. E preciso garantir que os poligonos mais proximos dos
> observador sejam desenhados sobre os poligonos mais distantes (realiza-se
> um calculo para determinar a ordem de desenho); a iluminacao precisa levar
> em conta as fontes de luz disponiveis em cada cena, bem como as
> caracteristicas dos materiais; se temos transparencias, o sistema tambem
> precisa desenhar corretamente os objetos que serao visiveis atraves do
> material transparente. Sao estes e outros cuidados que os programadores
> precisam levar em conta.
>
> Another 3d engine apresenta uma serie de modificacoes na logica de um 3d
> engine. Para isso, me baseei num 3d engine relativamente simples,
> desenvolvido em Java, chamado Browser3D, distribuido como software open
> source. A biblioteca Java2D foi utilizada para realizar estas
> modificacoes, que atuam na forma como os objetos sao desenhados.
>
> Para a realizacao do primeiro trabalho de Another 3d Engine, procurei uma
> cena que fosse o equivalente do 'hello world