curt cloninger
Since the beginning
Works in Canton, North Carolina United States of America

ARTBASE (7)
BIO
Curt Cloninger is an artist, writer, and Associate Professor of New Media at the University of North Carolina Asheville. His art undermines language as a system of meaning in order to reveal it as an embodied force in the world. His art work has been featured in the New York Times and at festivals and galleries from Korea to Brazil. Exhibition venues include Centre Georges Pompidou (Paris), Granoff Center for The Creative Arts (Brown University), Digital Art Museum [DAM] (Berlin), Ukrainian Institute of Modern Art (Chicago), Black Mountain College Museum + Arts Center, and the internet. He is the recipient of several grants and awards, including commissions for the creation of new artwork from the National Endowment for the Arts (via Turbulence.org) and Austin Peay State University's Terminal Award.

Cloninger has written on a wide range of topics, including new media and internet art, installation and performance art, experimental graphic design, popular music, network culture, and continental philosophy. His articles have appeared in Intelligent Agent, Mute, Paste, Tekka, Rhizome Digest, A List Apart, and on ABC World News. He is also the author of eight books, most recently One Per Year (Link Editions). He maintains lab404.com, playdamage.org , and deepyoung.org in hopes of facilitating a more lively remote dialogue with the Sundry Contagions of Wonder.
Discussions (1122) Opportunities (4) Events (17) Jobs (0)
DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re:the rapture and anti-environmentalism


Hi Tim,

This one has "off-list" written all over it. I'll send you an email.

peace,
curt

t.whid wrote:

> xx going way, way off the subject of new media art xx
>
> ++++
>
> I would be interested to hear from Curt, who seems to be (perhaps not
> moderate, but at least) a rational christian, why do oppose gay
> marriage?
>
> Is it simply because of the 'abomination' passage in the bible? If
> so,
> how do you square the fact that it seems that there are plenty of
> laws
> in the old testament of the bible that modern christians happily
> ignore.
>
> But yet they get stuck on this one. I'm curious why.
>
> I won't reply or try to argue with you (we've both over the years
> probably come to the conclusion that that is not very productive on
> either side).
>
> Just curious.
>
> If you feel open, I would be interested to hear your thoughts on
> evolution as well. The opposition to which I don't understand one
> bit.
> Being raised catholic and attending catholic schools, I can tell you
> that evolution and catholicism seem to coexist with no problem.
>
> take care,
>
>
> On Mar 22, 2005, at 3:33 PM, curt cloninger wrote:
>
> >
> > I'm probably not what you'd call a moderate Christian. I walk up
> to
> > strangers on the street and pray with them. You and I disagree
> about
> > most of the issues you mention (abortion, euthanasia, gay marriage,
> > Christian intention of US founding fathers). The point is, there's
> a
> > way to love and respect people with whom you disagree.
> >
> > As far as being the defender of orthodox Christianity versus
> > contemporary misunderstandings and oversimplifications of it, no
> > thanks. It's taken me two days to refute 1 Bill Moyers
> overstatement.
> >
> > http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew13:9-17
> >
> > peace,
> > curt
> ===
> <twhid>http://www.mteww.com</twhid>
> ===
>
>

DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the rapture and anti-environmentalism


Hi Francis,

I'm probably not what you'd call a moderate Christian. I walk up to strangers on the street and pray with them. You and I disagree about most of the issues you mention (abortion, euthanasia, gay marriage, Christian intention of US founding fathers). The point is, there's a way to love and respect people with whom you disagree.

As far as being the defender of orthodox Christianity versus contemporary misunderstandings and oversimplifications of it, no thanks. It's taken me two days to refute 1 Bill Moyers overstatement.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew13:9-17

peace,
curt

Francis Hwang wrote:

> True enough. And I suppose it's one paradox about this issue, that
> those who are most moderate about their faith are those who tend to
> be
> more quiet about it.
>
> But then, when other people are loudly hijacking a thing that you
> yourself stand for, what is your moral and social responsibility to
> stand up and be counted as a moderate? I'm willing to believe that
> there are plenty of good-hearted, sensible Christians in the U.S. But
> if their faith is being hijacked politically to spread an agenda of
> fear and ignorance, to what extent are they responsible for standing
> up? I know there are some Christians who are doing so--heck, the
> Roman
> Catholic church has just started making moves about being
> anti-death-penalty--but it feels to me like many are not.
>
> When the priest at my parent's church said those things about Iraqis,
> that was the thing that upset me the most. What he said about
> Iraqis--that suicide bombings happen there because they value life
> differently there--struck me as the sort of comfortable middle-class
> lie that people tell themselves to give themselves a reason not to
> get
> involved. The priest seems like a nice, well-meaning guy, but I start
> to wonder: The United States is a country at war. In Iraq, scores of
> people are dying everyday because of what we've done. Shouldn't
> somebody who's devoted his life to serving God's will be able to take
> the risk to speak out? Shouldn't we be able to expect some measure of
> moral courage from, of all places, a church?
>
> This isn't just a problem with only Christianity, of course. I wonder
> if Muslims have a similar responsibility to spend more energy to
> counter the fundamentalist strains in their midst. And although I
> don't
> have to deal with this in my own religious backyard, I've got similar
> issues, in a much smaller way, when it comes to the nascent scene of
> Ruby programmers. I just suggested that for next year, the national
> conference be held in a city in Canada (Vancouver? Montreal?) so that
> non-U.S.-citizens who are skittish about getting entered into a
> biometric database at the border can come. The average Rubyist, on
> one
> level, is quite like the average Christian: They both want to live
> their lives and celebrate certain modest activities, free of the
> burden
> of political participation. But shouldn't we be taking on that burden
> anyway?

DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the rapture and anti-environmentalism


Hi Nick,

Biblical Christianity occurs individual to individual, day to day, largely off the media radar. They tried to get Jesus to lead a political revolt and he would have none of it. I agree with you that the effects of one's faith should be real. They need not be limited to the material or political realm (because reality extends beyond matter and politics), but they should definitely include physical healing and physical miracles.

You know me. You're welcome to come to church with me and the fam some Sunday or come feed the homeless with us some Saturday or come to our home group some Sunday night. Send me an email if you like.

peace,
curt

p.s. i like your showreel. you are insane.

nick owens wrote:

> > But Christianity is also being exercised properly all over the
> place
> > (even in the US) with the standard miraculous results.
> >
>
> standard?
>
> Isn't this the story of christianity, or mythology, however you want
> to
> put it.
> We believe in the story of the action more than the reality? The
> prejudice of others is a healthy one in reference to religion,
> because
> so much of it is the 'story', not the reality.
> The standard story works, like all mythologies as good propaganda.
>
> What's the final judgement of the standard miraculous result?
>
> Standard miraculous results of Christianity in <place> = standard
> democratic result in, say, ...Iraq?, in America?
> its the story of these institutions that deserves prejudice, because
> of
> the history.
>

DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the rapture and anti-environmentalism


Hi Francis,

You'd be right about some Christians and wrong about other Christians. Most of the "orthodox" Christians alive in the world today are actually African Anglicans or South American Pentacostals. Contemporary Protestant Christianity in America has a lot to answer for. It's often badly exercised Christianity. But Christianity is also being exercised properly all over the place (even in the US) with the standard miraculous results.

peace,
curt

Francis Hwang wrote:

> Now. If I didn't have many Christians who I love in respect in my
> family, I would be forced to conclude this about contemporary
> Christianity: That everything good and hopeful about it has been
> hollowed out, that all that is left is a shell of an religion grafted
> to a political machine. That those who seek solace in Christian faith
> are invariably weak or small-minded or simply psychotic, and they
> would
> accept the uncritical belief in a spiritual mystery over the burdens
> of
> rational knowledge and personal introspection. That their political
> agenda is even more of a danger to the United States than that of the
> terrorists of Al Qaeda, because while such terrorists may seek to
> kill
> our bodies and disrupt our economy, contemporary Christians seek
> instead to rewrite history, replace democracy with theocracy, and
> turn
> back the Enlightenment.
>
> Would I be wrong, Curt?

DISCUSSION

Re: Re: Re: the rapture and anti-environmentalism


Hi Francis,

"Oppression" is surely too strong a word in relation to contemporary US Christians (although in Sudan and China it's spot on). "Prejudice" may be a more accurate word -- judgment based on hunch/bias vs. knowledge.

majority/minority; white/black; rich/poor -- all that is a bogey. You don't have to be in a minority for someone to be prejudiced against you. You don't have to be non-white for someone to be prejudiced against you. You don't have to be poor for someone to be prejudiced against you. You simply have to have someone make a prejudgment of you not based on fact or logic.

There is this notion that a little prejudice against the current majority is just the thing to even out the imbalance of power. Creepy.

peace,
curt

Francis Hwang wrote:

> I suppose in some ways it depends on your social frame of reference.
> My
> mother, who is not particularly political or conservative, but is
> fairly devoutly Christian, has trotted out the line about Christians
> being oppressed, which I find kind of unusual, but then, I'm probably
> the only athiest she knows. On the other hand, many of my friends my
> age expressed dismay when I told them a few years ago that my dad was
> getting baptized. I viewed as a mostly positive development, but a
> lot
> of my friends grew in repressive environments, and a number of them
> are
> gay, which isn't going to make them all gung-ho about religion
> either.
> Here in NYC, I don't know many people who I'd consider devout in any
> form, really, except for a friend of mine who's Muslim and tells me
> the
> words "Insh'alla" (sp?) are never far from her lips.
>
> So. In a country that's increasingly socially polarized, it's easy to
> find somebody who doesn't know any Christians, and it's easy to find
> somebody who doesn't know anybody who's not Christian.
>
> As a general line of argument I have to say that I find the idea of
> Christians being oppressed--at least in the U.S.--a sort of repugnant
> one borne out of backlash, sort of on par with people talking about
> white males being an endangered species. But what Curt says is true,
> in
> the certain social circles I travel in, and I suppose Curt travels in
> as well. In conversations with friends and associates who are
> variously
> hackers, queers, academics, artists, etc., I find myself defending
> Christianity most of the time. The time I find myself attacking
> Christianity is when I'm home for Christmas. ;)